Mystery Bayonet |
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Lemon
Newbie Joined: July 24 2021 Location: Brisbane Status: Offline Points: 4 |
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Posted: July 24 2021 at 6:28am |
I went to an arms fair recently and purchased this Bayonet specifically because it doesn't make sense.
A short description of the images. Blade markings of Remington manufacture P1913 dated 7/1916 with commonwealth broad arrow->crown->AB->A crown->AB->A repeated next to a bend "proof mark" X. Not over marked. No markings on pommel or bayonet lug grove. Handle is SLAZ42. Cross guard with abnormally large loop measuring approx 23mm internal diameter. Blade Length of 430mm No markings whatsoever on scabbard Please help! |
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Moondog55
Senior Member Joined: July 05 2011 Location: Geelong Austral Status: Offline Points: 103 |
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Trench warfare shotgun??
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A square 10
Special Member Donating Member Joined: December 12 2006 Location: MN , USA Status: Offline Points: 14452 |
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i believe what you have is a pattern 1913 bayonet for the pattern 14 [no3] rifle , they were made by remington , winchester and vickers[very early] , they have most of the same specs as a pattern 1907 save the crossguard/muzzle ring
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Lemon
Newbie Joined: July 24 2021 Location: Brisbane Status: Offline Points: 4 |
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I forgot to add a photo of the crossguard.
After the shot gun suggestion i looked at other fire arms for this bayonet and found that owen gun and jungle carbine bayonets have a similar arrangement even with the small hole on the bottom half.
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A square 10
Special Member Donating Member Joined: December 12 2006 Location: MN , USA Status: Offline Points: 14452 |
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6that leaves me cold on this one - i suspect its been messed with but i cant say for sure , that is not a pattern 14 muzzle ring from the photo ,
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Lemon
Newbie Joined: July 24 2021 Location: Brisbane Status: Offline Points: 4 |
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Yeah I'm quite confused, either it was rehandle in WW2 hence the slaz 42 handle with a different crossguard put on it or maybe someone had two bayonets and change the well conditioned parts in an attempt to get more cash for it.
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muddyboots
Newbie Joined: September 20 2021 Location: Nebraska, US Status: Offline Points: 15 |
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Never seen this before. Bayonet looks great
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Marco1010
Senior Member Joined: February 04 2020 Location: New Zealand Status: Offline Points: 400 |
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Looking at the muzzle ring, it looks like there are slight raised edges inside the ring. I think there was a round shim previously in place which has either been removed or fallen out perhaps.
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shiloh
Senior Member Joined: January 08 2019 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 2369 |
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I know late to the show but, your bayonet is probably for the Owen sub machine gun, nice find.
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Lead from the front; eliminate all obstacles...
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Stumpkiller
Senior Member Joined: April 03 2020 Location: Port Crane, NY Status: Offline Points: 254 |
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Owens bayonets were shortened (10" blade, later 8") M1907 with metal scabbards with web frogs..
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Charlie P.
Life is not about how fast you run, or how high you climb, but how well you bounce. |
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PERCH
Newbie Joined: December 28 2021 Location: AUSTRALIA Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Slaz on the wood stands for Slazenger and they were Australian made. The bayonet fits an Australian Owen machine gun.
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SGonger
Senior Member Joined: February 20 2021 Location: Utah U.S.A Status: Offline Points: 418 |
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Oz troops had the full length modificatied 1907 patt bayonet in use in Korea on the Owens gun.
Cheer’s.
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Anyone seen the Tardis Box anywhere? 🤨
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Zed
Special Member Donating Member Joined: May 01 2012 Location: France Status: Offline Points: 5585 |
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Great information
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It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!
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SGonger
Senior Member Joined: February 20 2021 Location: Utah U.S.A Status: Offline Points: 418 |
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The different length Patt 1907 bayonet attached to the Owens Gun.
Cheer’s.
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Anyone seen the Tardis Box anywhere? 🤨
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BJ72
Senior Member Joined: August 24 2019 Location: Qld Australia Status: Offline Points: 109 |
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I don’t believe this bayonet is for the Australian Owen gun. To the best of my knowledge all Owen bayonets are Of Australian manufacture but I could be wrong. Early ones were converted by shorting existing stocks of pattern 1907 bayonets and the later ones were new manufacture. The cross guard on an Owen bayonet has the same size hole as a standard pattern 1907 bayonet. The Owen bayonet will fit on a No1 Mk3 SMLE rifle and a standard pattern 1907 bayonet will fit on the Owen. They will both interchange. The difference is in blade length. I’m no expert on the subject, but this has always been my understanding. There has been discussion in the past around some Australian troops carrying the Owen bayonet in Korea for use on the SMLE. As per the above photograph, both lengths were used on the Owen. The shorter Owen bayonet made sense for jungle warfare where the Owen was first put to service in WWII.
Happy new year everyone.
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My idea of gun control is hitting what I aim at and nothing else.
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Sarge
Senior Member Joined: April 20 2013 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 495 |
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Lemon...
I'm a tad late in picking up this thread... however... I can solve the mystery of why your P13 has an '07' style crossguard. If you look at the detailing within the red circles on the attached pic, you'll note evidence of welding. This is one of the better examples which I have encountered over the years. In order to fit the P13 to an SMLE, certain Home Guard units took it upon themselves ( who were fortunate enough to have been issued with the SMLE... or acquired them by 'Other' means ) to slice off the P13 muzzle ring post, and fabricate one to suit the SMLE. The first pic shows the difference in fitting between the SMLE and P14 rifles. |
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This is MY rifle, there are many like, but this one... is MINE!
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