Rifles that never were
Printed From: Enfield-Rifles.com
Category: Enfields
Forum Name: After Market Enfields
Forum Description: What have you done to that Enfield??
URL: http://www.enfield-rifles.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=10867
Printed Date: March 26 2026 at 7:10pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.07 - https://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Rifles that never were
Posted By: Frameman 1
Subject: Rifles that never were
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 7:55am
I’ve got two rifles that never were. The first bears a Numerich import stamp the other has no import marks. One is a cut down Ishapore 2A1 made to mimic a Jungle Carbine the other is also a cut down Ishapore and referred to as a Bulldog Tanker Carbine. Both needed extensive work to the recoil draws but turned them both into great fun shooters 
------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Replies:
Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 7:58am
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I always kinda sorts wanted the tanker, but as a No4. Then I heard about several of them literally blowing the front end off where the shortened stock was re-spliced under the sling swivel band! I lost interest at that point. ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 8:03am
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The story was true. Mine did exactly that. The splice was literally put together with Some sort of paste and a wooden dowel. I did a proper repair using Acraglas and inlaid brass pins. 100 rounds later and no more issues.
------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 8:21am
| Gibbs Rifle Company made them for a time. My dad has both of those rifles pictured. The story told to him from a private seller was that they were one off rifles and never put into service. I fpund out later in life that Gubbs Rifle Company,now Navy Arms made them. Visit their website. |
Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 8:27am
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You and your Dad are correct. I have done some reading about Gibbs and Navy Arms. I intend to contact N/A to ask if they have any documented history on these rifles. ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 8:41am
| They also made one to fire the 45/70. |
Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 8:42am
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not familiar with that one. ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 8:49am
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Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 8:51am
| Goosic. I remember seeing adverts in late 70's and 80's on the 45/70 Lee Enfield conversion. For some reason I remember the magazine didn't need replacing nor the bolt. I think it was just the barrel, but I could be wrong as it was ages ago. Even back then I thought it would be a cool rifle. American Rifle? The magazine was called something like that. I thought it was Gibbs. |
Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 8:52am
| THAT would stop most anything in it's hooves or paws! |
Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 9:10am
| The magazine was redeveloped as a 4 or 5 round single stack. I had alot of magazine articles on this rifle as a teenager. Gibbs refers to the Jungle Carbine as the Gibbs Enfield Aussie No7 and the No4 as the Summit Frontier 45/70 Carbine. |
Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 9:39am
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it’s amazing that there are so many variations. ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 1:22pm
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That looks great sporterized. ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 1:52pm
How about a sporterized No4Mk1/2 Maltby rebarrelled to fire 7.62x51mm NATO rounds that i just finished this morning? 
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Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 2:54pm
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Wherever did you find that beautiful buttstock? It’s a thing of beauty. ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 3:14pm
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FWIW most of the "shortened" Gibbs rifles were made that way because of cord wear at the muzzle from incorrect, or over use of the pull through. The simply chopped off the worn section, re-crowned & trimmed the wood, & Bingo done! "The Gibbs Rifle Co", should NOT be confused with the original "J & G Gibbs" in England who made (& still make) one off, hand crafted bespoke rifles! I was lucky they were my LGS growing up in Bristol! https://gibbsgunmakers.com/?page_id=9" rel="nofollow - https://gibbsgunmakers.com/?page_id=9 ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 3:52pm
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Was it possible to attach an Ishapore 7.62NATO barrel to the #4 Maltby receiver? I expect you have free floated the barrel. ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 3:54pm
The stock set is made by Sile. It was originally used on Parker Hale or Santa Fe reworked Enfield rifles.
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Frameman 1 wrote:Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 3:56pm
The barrel is in fact a 2A1 Ishapore barrel re-indexed to mate to the No4 reciever. And no, it is not free floated. It has a 1 inch contact point where the end of the forestock meets the barrel.
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Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 4:01pm
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Beautiful furniture! Please post your range report after your test drive. ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: October 03 2020 at 4:06pm
Boyd's makes some pretty neat looking laminated stocks for the No1 and No4 rifles. This color is AppleJack... 
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Posted By: The Armourer
Date Posted: October 04 2020 at 12:41am
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"The stock set is made by Sile. It was originally used on Parker Hale or Santa Fe reworked Enfield rifles." Sile also made the Butts for the Lee Enfield Enforcer rifle, the forends being supplied by Colin Moon (South Coast UK)
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Posted By: A square 10
Date Posted: October 04 2020 at 6:03pm
| all of these gibbs and santa fe rifles have found a niche in the collecting world as what they are - fantasy rifles made for the commercial market , but keep in mind the aussies did make their own version of the no 5 - it was the no 6 and as rare as they get as well as that valuable so never just walk away till your certain what you are looking at - good to know all the key points to watch for if possible to be certain - do your homework |
Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 04 2020 at 10:02pm
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I hope to come across a real Jungle Cabine and will look for the proper rear sight And lightening cuts on the receiver and barrel knock. Maybe I’ll get lucky and the seller won’t know what he has.😎 ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 04 2020 at 10:14pm
Here are photos of the recoil plates I made and installed on my Ishapore rifles ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: October 05 2020 at 3:35pm
A No5Mk1 converted to fire 7.62x51mm NATO using a 2A1 barrel. 
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Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 05 2020 at 4:02pm
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Please excuse my ignorance but what is the T-handle directly in front of the magazine? ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 05 2020 at 4:03pm
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Stunning example for sure. ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Canuck
Date Posted: October 05 2020 at 4:13pm
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Yes, Goosic does some amazing work! ------------- Castles made of sand slip into the sea.....eventually |
Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: October 05 2020 at 4:51pm
| I believe it's a sling swivel on a king screw. |
Posted By: WilliamS
Date Posted: October 05 2020 at 4:53pm
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Just ordered a barrel blank for a 6.5 Creedmoor No4 build. Should be here sometime in December. I'm aiming for a sub 7.5lb rifle empty, about a 21" barrel, should be attainable. I'm thinking I'll put the PH5C on this one, and I'll use the Sterling magazine. At some point I'll do a 7-30 Waters as well but I haven't selected an action for that one. Frameman, that's a king screw target sling swivel in front of the magazine.
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Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 05 2020 at 6:08pm
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are there any photos of this sling swivel in action? ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: October 05 2020 at 6:51pm
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Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 06 2020 at 12:32am
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Thanks for the photo. This is a variation of the sling placement I learned in USMC rifle training using an M14. ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: October 06 2020 at 9:06am
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You can also utilize a "ChingSling" style sling. See Ian's video for the details & a comparison between the Ching & the P1907 slings. The image above shows the use, but the shooter's body is blocking the fact there is no rear end to the sling! Its basically just the front loop of the P1907 sling! the "extra swivel" s a direct replacement for the main screw & goes in in about 5 minutes. The swivel is angled also which helps with "forming the loop". I have a 1907 on my SMLE but prefer the Ching for most things.  ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: October 06 2020 at 10:05am
| I absolutely know I'm gonna get beat up, but in all my years of hunting and shooting all kinds of rifles, (40+ years) I've never used a sling for any other purpose than to hang it off my shoulder. Even then, rarely as I've always been a "carry in hand" person, more often than not like I'm carrying a shot gun. |
Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: October 06 2020 at 12:35pm
| Meant carrying it shotgun style... kinda like a lot of bird hunters do. Hard to explain without a picture. |
Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: October 06 2020 at 3:03pm
The swivel screw in the T rifle was bought specifically for looks. I will never use it for its intended purpose. 
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Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 06 2020 at 4:01pm
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I know this isn’t the correct section of this forum to ask this but since we’re here. Does anyone have one to sell reasonably. ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: A square 10
Date Posted: October 06 2020 at 8:14pm
| those are somewhat harder to find , ive not seen any available in a bit , couple of my trainers sport them but never on any of my service rifles , |
Posted By: WilliamS
Date Posted: October 06 2020 at 8:20pm
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Not mine. Found these on eBay. Spendy! https://www.ebay.com/itm/302924549154" rel="nofollow - https://www.ebay.com/itm/302924549154
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Posted By: Goosic
Date Posted: October 06 2020 at 9:15pm
| The Parker Hale brand are longer than the military version and will not foul itself on the trigger guard loop. |
Posted By: Frameman 1
Date Posted: October 06 2020 at 11:00pm
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I saw these as well . I don’t know if I want one that badly$ ------------- There are no Americans in Baghdad!! |
Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: October 07 2020 at 7:25am
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There's a reason they foul & stop rotating. It prevents the sling from becoming twisted. I've had the fully rotating P-H & the shorter "Issue" ones & prefer the issue. Its no fun untangling that sling on the range. ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: October 07 2020 at 8:24am
| The kingscrew swivel gets fouled up on my Faux L42A... oops! Got schooled on that name! I'm not sure what to call the rifle now but it does have the king screw mentioned that fouls. |
Posted By: Zed
Date Posted: October 07 2020 at 12:33pm
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These swivels are also fitted to the No8 Lee Enfield .22 trainers ------------- It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice! |
Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: October 07 2020 at 2:04pm
Split the difference call it an L40.5 A1/2!  ------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: Honkytonk
Date Posted: October 07 2020 at 2:36pm
| That will be the rifles new name!! |
Posted By: Shamu
Date Posted: October 08 2020 at 7:47am
  
------------- Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force) |
Posted By: britrifles
Date Posted: October 09 2020 at 5:56am
We won’t beat you up HT. Not even for sayin “kingscrew”. The only place you are likely to see a sling used in this manner is on the shooting range. It does two things: pulls the rifle into the shoulder and assists in a steady hold of the rifle. Both of these things improve accuracy. I’d guess that my prone shooting group sizes are nearly cut in half by using a sling. |
Posted By: Charlie Gillman
Date Posted: December 02 2020 at 1:06pm
I was married to a woman that loved garage sales. Friday morning she'd be out and doing the circuit. The local paper had a section devoted to garage and yard sales, so she'd get a copy and take off early. One Friday she got a Springfield 1903 stock in great shape for $4 and this early Eddystone P14 action (ERA 516xx) for $70. I hung the Springfield stock on the wall in the kitchen, a great decoration, and had a local gunsmith install a Shilen XX barrel on the P14 action. The unfinished stock came from Great American Gunstock, no longer in business. I completed the rifle in 2002, she died in 2008 and I inherited all her firearms. Fannie May called, wanted me to pay off her Student Loan debt, but I had to refuse, she incurred the debt before we were married. They never called back.   ------------- Gill |