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N140 Loads with 174 gr SMK

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Shamu View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 18 2025 at 3:53pm
I'm supposedly "off to the range" tomorrow.
Fingers crossed.
A new store is opening near where in our closest "big town" Easton, Md, down here in the flatlands of the Eastern Shore. It will be only one of two in the entire area with reloading supplies.Clap

https://peteskillman.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Big-MD-Map.png

Not just yet, we drove past today doing other things & its Under Construction where they're re fronting an existing store.
They're claiming a "soft open" this month & a "Grand Opening" in August.

Don't shoot till you see the whites of their thighs. (Unofficial motto of the Royal Air Force)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sapper740 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2025 at 4:19am
Always good to hear a new gun store is opening up near one of our members Shamu especially when you consider the efforts the Dems made in Blue cities to inhibit/prohibit gun stores.  My hip replacement is getting very close to being healed enough that I can resume shooting again although prone might be a problem.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2025 at 4:31am
That looks like good news Shamu.
Last weekend I visited a family owned gun shop in Dreux ( France ), it's been there since 1920.
Father to son. It has so much stock, plus very helpful service.
I hope to get the chance to visit a gun shop and shooting range during my visit to the USA next month.
It will be interesting to compare with the European market.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Strangely Brown Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2025 at 4:53am
Originally posted by britrifles britrifles wrote:

To duplicate Mk VII velocity specification (2440 fps),  40.3 to 40.4 gr N140 with 174 SMK

This is interesting Geoff and a lesson in having to rethink historical data, some 30 years ago it was accepted here that it required 41.8grs on N140 to replicate the MkVII rounds ballistic capabilities.  

Either N140 has got hotter or the chrono's have become more accurate over the years, or possibly a case of both? 
I will now have to rethink my loading data...no bad thing given the cost of propellant! 

Mick
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2025 at 11:46am
Zed:
check your PM's! Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sapper740 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2025 at 12:55pm
Originally posted by Strangely Brown Strangely Brown wrote:

[QUOTE=britrifles]
Either N140 has got hotter or the chrono's have become more accurate over the years, or possibly a case of both?

You raise a valid point SB regarding chrono's possibly becoming more accurate over the years.  I have an Oehler which I've owned for years and a recently purchased Garmin Xero.  I was interested in doing a side-by-side comparison to see if there was a difference of any significance between the two and found two small differences:  The Garmin recorded slightly higher velocities which is no surprise as the Garmin is recording actual muzzle velocity whereas the sky screens on the Oehler are recording velocities 10 to 12 feet down range but there was one interesting difference: the Oehler reported a slightly higher extreme spread than the Garmin.  I put that down to differing light levels as clouds scudded overhead affecting when the glint of the bullet was picked up.  Are the readings off enough to make a difference in the real world?  Probably not as the average velocity readings were only 4 fps different and the ES was only 3 fps higher with the Oehler.  One last point, the Garmin is many times easier to set up and use than the Oehler which now sits unused in my shop.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A square 10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2025 at 4:47pm
im voting good news to start - leyt them prove me wrong , gotta be optimistic 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote britrifles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 21 2025 at 3:37am
With my Shooting Chrony Alpha Master, I would sometimes get 150 fps difference with the sky screens on or off.  In some lighting conditions, I would get a large velocity change from a previous test. I returned it and they sent me a new one but I never totally trusted it. 

These little Garmin chrono's have really made collecting velocity data easy.  Don't leave home without it. 

 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 21 2025 at 3:57am
Geoff, are you allowed to use the Garmin chronograph during a competition, to record your data?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote britrifles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 21 2025 at 4:35am
Good question Shaun, I believe the answer is yes.  

I've been meaning to use mine during the sniper match to keep from making scope elevation adjustments from a high or low velocity shot (error chase); and in that way, it seems it would be contrary to the spirit of the rules.  

There is a rule about no electronic devices that make noise that other shooters can hear.  We have had some debate about use of small portable fans (keeps the shooting glasses from fogging over) because of "altering environmental conditions" but there is no such rule that I can find.  I've seen both fans and Garmin chrono's on the line at a match.  


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Strangely Brown Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 21 2025 at 5:40am
Shaun's post got me thinking what we're allowed over here.
Looking at the current rules I would say Garmin's are allowed at Bisley but I've never actually seen one being used in a competition.
 
Electronic Devices 309 
Cellular or mobile telephones, or similar devices, may not at any time be used on or in the vicinity of the firing point, unless their communication functions are disabled eg by placing in ‘flight mode’. Personal electronic devices may be taken to the firing point, provided they are NOT able to receive wireless transmissions. Hardware or software for shot or score recording or assisting with the process of the competition is forbidden, unless issued or explicitly permitted by the competition organisers. Electronic equipment provided by the organisers, or explicitly permitted by them, for the purposes of electronic targetry or spectator information systems are permitted. Where wireless personal devices are explicitly permitted for the receipt and display of electronic target information, the screens of such devices are liable to view by the Register Keeper or a Range Officer on demand and at any time. The wearing of implanted medical devices or hearing aids in everyday use is not prevented by this rule. The only means of communication between the butts and the firing point will be that formally used by the Range and Butt Officers. While firing is actually taking place no person in the butts is permitted to use any other means of communication that could be contacted by any person in sight of the firing point. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 21 2025 at 10:53am
How about things like anemometer hygrometer  or combination units with wind-speed rH & temp?
Nothing RF generating just pen & pencil.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote britrifles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 21 2025 at 11:14am
CMP Rules allow the use of wind meters/indicators (either mechanical or electronic), but only behind the firing line.  A combo unit that would measure windspeed, temp and humidity is also allowed.  

I've occasionally seen shooters pull out a wind meter.  Also, many service/match rifle shooters will use a spotting scope to read the mirage (at about mid range to the target). I've never been successful at doing this so I watch the flags closest to the firing line (typically); for example, I'll watch the 200 yd flag when shooting at 600 yds.   The wind has to be pretty strong and full value to make much difference at 200x, in those cases I might dial in a minute correction.    

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Strangely Brown Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 21 2025 at 11:54am
Originally posted by britrifles britrifles wrote:

CMP Rules allow the use of wind meters/indicators (either mechanical or electronic), but only behind the firing line. 

Same over Geoff but you only ever see tactical shooters use them; most of us usually work off a printed card.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shamu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 21 2025 at 12:38pm
I've actually attached a 3' length of tree marking tape to the wrist strap.
I use it to get a true wind angle with the meter.
Mostly I use it for background information for my logbooks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 21 2025 at 12:56pm
SB, I think the line:
 "Hardware or software for shot or score recording or assisting with the process of the competition is forbidden."

May give rise to possible complaints from shooters who aren't equiped with the Garmin Chrono.
I France we are not allowed portable phones or ear phones of any sort that can receive message on the firing line.



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